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Trump to eliminate birthright citizenship

Posted: Tue Oct 30, 2018 6:55 am
by MN-Skeptic
From Axios -

Exclusive: Trump to terminate birthright citizenship
President Trump plans to sign an executive order that would remove the right to citizenship for babies of non-citizens and unauthorized immigrants born on U.S. soil, he said yesterday in an exclusive interview for "Axios on HBO," a new four-part documentary news series debuting on HBO this Sunday at 6:30 p.m. ET/PT.

Why it matters: This would be the most dramatic move yet in Trump's hardline immigration campaign, this time targeting "anchor babies" and "chain migration." And it will set off another stand-off with the courts, as Trump’s power to do this through executive action is debatable to say the least.

Trump told "Axios on HBO" that he has run the idea of ending birthright citizenship by his counsel and plans to proceed with the highly controversial move, which certainly will face legal challenges.
  • "It was always told to me that you needed a constitutional amendment. Guess what? You don't," Trump said, declaring he can do it by executive order.
  • When told that's very much in dispute, Trump replied: "You can definitely do it with an Act of Congress. But now they're saying I can do it just with an executive order."
  • "We're the only country in the world where a person comes in and has a baby, and the baby is essentially a citizen of the United States ... with all of those benefits," Trump continued. "It's ridiculous. It's ridiculous. And it has to end."
  • "It's in the process. It'll happen ... with an executive order."
The president expressed surprise that "Axios on HBO" knew about his secret plan: "I didn't think anybody knew that but me. I thought I was the only one. "
More at the link

They're evil.

Re: Trump to eliminate birthright citizenship

Posted: Tue Oct 30, 2018 6:59 am
by Foggy
Two words:

Wong Kim Ark


:boxing:

Re: Trump to eliminate birthright citizenship

Posted: Tue Oct 30, 2018 7:00 am
by RoadScholar
Red meat for the base.

Or more accurately perhaps, a Happy Meal.

Re: Trump to eliminate birthright citizenship

Posted: Tue Oct 30, 2018 7:09 am
by ZekeB
Does it say anywhere in the constitution that Thump can't abolish the constitution by executive order? Perhaps he's only line item abolishing it.

Re: Trump to eliminate birthright citizenship

Posted: Tue Oct 30, 2018 7:30 am
by fierceredpanda
Will any "constitutional conservatives" have the integrity to point out that this is a preposterous lie? :nope:

Re: Trump to eliminate birthright citizenship

Posted: Tue Oct 30, 2018 7:46 am
by Jez
fierceredpanda wrote: Tue Oct 30, 2018 7:30 am Will any "constitutional conservatives" have the integrity to point out that this is a preposterous lie? :nope:
If I remember correctly, a lot of the "constitutional conservatives" were the ones bemoaning birthright citizenship when it applied to the last occupant of the White House.

Re: Trump to eliminate birthright citizenship

Posted: Tue Oct 30, 2018 7:48 am
by Mr Brolin
Yeah, this is just another one of his content, reality and meaning free dog whistles to his base.

He'll have either forgotten about it or just outright lie about ever saying it by end of business tomorrow.

Then, like a junkie in withdrawal, when he has to feed the sad miserable little piece of garbage that passes for his soul by desperately seeking relevance and air time, he'll resurrect it as a "new" idea again.

The press will squeal, he'll generate more of the publicity he cannot survive without, rinse and repeat.

:blahblah: :torches:

Re: Trump to eliminate birthright citizenship

Posted: Tue Oct 30, 2018 8:12 am
by neeneko
Yeah, I doubt he is actually planning anything or actually intends to try to sign anything, I doubt there is even a 'they' telling him he can do this.

But it puts the progressive back on the reactive and shifts the story to something that might benefit republicans at the polls.

Re: Trump to eliminate birthright citizenship

Posted: Tue Oct 30, 2018 8:14 am
by Tarrant
Even if it gets struck down, he’ll have thrown the red meat, and he can bemoan the “activist” courts and that his base needs to keep voting for him so he can appoint judges that will rule the way he wants (regardless of the text of actual laws or Constitutional amendments).

Re: Trump to eliminate birthright citizenship

Posted: Tue Oct 30, 2018 8:54 am
by fierceredpanda
Worse, Jim Vande Hei from Axios (whom I loathe for promoting the idea that politics is nothing more than a sport, and the job of political journalists is to tell their audience what the score is from day to day) said this morning that "most lawyers" disagree with the President. That's a horrendous misstatement that gives the impression that at least some lawyers do say that birthright citizenship can be ended by executive fiat. Any attorney who would say such a thing in the face of the text of the Fourteenth Amendment and Wong Kim Ark is playing fast and loose with the law - not to mention their license to practice.

Re: Trump to eliminate birthright citizenship

Posted: Tue Oct 30, 2018 9:37 am
by Volkonski
Scott Wong

Verified account

@scottwongDC
Following Following @scottwongDC
More
GOP Pushback to Trump birthright EO already starting. Here's Rep. @CarloslCurbelo (R-FL), who's in a tightening race in Miami: "Birthright citizenship is protected by the Constitution."

8:27 AM - 30 Oct 2018
Trump's eliminate birthright citizenship idea might just give some some usually Republican voting immigrants and their families second thoughts.

Re: Trump to eliminate birthright citizenship

Posted: Tue Oct 30, 2018 9:40 am
by BrianH
neeneko wrote: Tue Oct 30, 2018 8:12 am Yeah, I doubt he is actually planning anything or actually intends to try to sign anything, I doubt there is even a 'they' telling him he can do this.

But it puts the progressive back on the reactive and shifts the story to something that might benefit republicans at the polls.
I think there's an E.O. forthcoming. My recollection is that when Trump has said "I'm thinking of doing X" (e.g., "I'm thinking of pardoning _____"), he's followed through. He'll test this out at a rally (with the highly predictable favorable reaction) and then do it. So long as doing so shifts the media narrative and the perception this will help turn out the base on Nov. 6, it's all good in Trump's view.

(Side note: Apuzzo must be gladdened at the prospect of pretending to be relevant again.)

Re: Trump to eliminate birthright citizenship

Posted: Tue Oct 30, 2018 9:49 am
by mmmirele
Lawrence Tribe nails it:



On the one hand, I think of this as red meat for his xenophobic base. On the other hand, I did get a chill reading this.

Re: Trump to eliminate birthright citizenship

Posted: Tue Oct 30, 2018 9:50 am
by Volkonski
Scott Wong

Verified account

@scottwongDC
3m3 minutes ago
More Scott Wong Retweeted Justin Amash
GOP Rep. @JustinAmash of Michigan says Trump's EO on birthright citizenship is illegal: "A president cannot amend Constitution or laws via executive order."

Re: Trump to eliminate birthright citizenship

Posted: Tue Oct 30, 2018 9:51 am
by Dr. Kenneth Noisewater
Foggy wrote: Tue Oct 30, 2018 6:59 am Two words:

Wong Kim Ark


:boxing:
Anyone want to take bets about Mike Volin not addressing how illegal this would be on his show tonight?

Re: Trump to eliminate birthright citizenship

Posted: Tue Oct 30, 2018 9:53 am
by Dr. Kenneth Noisewater
BrianH wrote: Tue Oct 30, 2018 9:40 am
neeneko wrote: Tue Oct 30, 2018 8:12 am Yeah, I doubt he is actually planning anything or actually intends to try to sign anything, I doubt there is even a 'they' telling him he can do this.

But it puts the progressive back on the reactive and shifts the story to something that might benefit republicans at the polls.
I think there's an E.O. forthcoming. My recollection is that when Trump has said "I'm thinking of doing X" (e.g., "I'm thinking of pardoning _____"), he's followed through. He'll test this out at a rally (with the highly predictable favorable reaction) and then do it. So long as doing so shifts the media narrative and the perception this will help turn out the base on Nov. 6, it's all good in Trump's view.

(Side note: Apuzzo must be gladdened at the prospect of pretending to be relevant again.)
Oh I'm sure there will be he'll just get distracted, walk away and forget to sign it.

Re: Trump to eliminate birthright citizenship

Posted: Tue Oct 30, 2018 10:04 am
by Notorial Dissent
Usually just about anything bright and shiny you mean is how it works, but in this case I think he is desperate for any kind of distraction from his latest foot in mouthisms.

Re: Trump to eliminate birthright citizenship

Posted: Tue Oct 30, 2018 10:16 am
by Atticus Finch
So Trump thinks he can issue an Executive Order to redefine birthright or Jus soli citizenship?

The first section of the fourteenth amendment declares that: "All persons born or naturalized in the United States, and subject to the jurisdiction thereof, are citizens of the United States and of the states wherein they reside."

If Trump can change the definition of the term "all persons born" in the 14th Amendment by a simple Executive Order then why can't he change the definition of the term "searches and seizures" in the 4th Amendment or "freedom of speech" in the 1st Amendment or "to have assistance of counsel for his defence" in the 6th Amendment by Executive Orders.

The simple answer is that he can't.

If he wants to change the terms of the language in the Constitution he only needs to amend the Constitution under Article V of the Constitution.

If Trump were a tinhorn dictator of a third world country, simple Executive Orders will do the trick in changing language in that country's written Constitution. Trump's buddy President Xi Jinping of China became President for Life with the help of the rubber stamp legislature by removing the China Constitution's term limits for President.

Re: Trump to eliminate birthright citizenship

Posted: Tue Oct 30, 2018 10:20 am
by Dan1100
Sounds like pillow talk with Stephen Miller about his hopes and dreams one night and then the next morning Trump repeats it as possible policy. :eek2:

Re: Trump to eliminate birthright citizenship

Posted: Tue Oct 30, 2018 10:23 am
by AndyinPA
Obviously, there's an election coming up, so time to throw out some red meat to the cannibals.

:bigvomit:

There is no bottom to this horror of a man.

Re: Trump to eliminate birthright citizenship

Posted: Tue Oct 30, 2018 10:24 am
by Mikedunford
Here's my Twitter thread on the issue, if anyone's interested:


Re: Trump to eliminate birthright citizenship

Posted: Tue Oct 30, 2018 10:47 am
by Kendra
AndyinPA wrote: Tue Oct 30, 2018 10:23 am Obviously, there's an election coming up, so time to throw out some red meat to the cannibals.

:bigvomit:

There is no bottom to this horror of a man.
Comment of the day.

Re: Trump to eliminate birthright citizenship

Posted: Tue Oct 30, 2018 10:49 am
by jmj
Mikedunford wrote: Tue Oct 30, 2018 10:24 am Here's my Twitter thread on the issue, if anyone's interested:

Great thread Mike. I may pass that around.

Re: Trump to eliminate birthright citizenship

Posted: Tue Oct 30, 2018 10:50 am
by Reality Check
I interested to see what Jonathan Turley has to say about the EO. He has had his head so far up Trump's butt he hasn't been seen in months. Well, actually I am not interested.

Re: Trump to eliminate birthright citizenship

Posted: Tue Oct 30, 2018 10:59 am
by Kendra
Swalwell Retweeted Axios

Put this in perspective. @realDonaldTrump is willing to delete a passage from the Constitution to target people who don’t look like him. BUT he’s unwilling to do anything to protect you from violence, arguing that it would conflict with the Second Amendment in same Constitution.