ernie-wayne: ter Telgte

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neeneko
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Re: ernie-wayne: ter Telgte

#126

Post by neeneko » Thu Jun 07, 2018 10:06 am

Fortinbras wrote:
Thu Jun 07, 2018 9:41 am
But, the worst part, even when they succeed, the defendant might avoid regular prison BUT instead get sent to psychiatric prison - a psych hospital with bars and locks and such. Even if he gets sent to a regular psych hospital he ends up with fewer civil rights than if he were an ordinary inmate in an ordinary prison and frequently with an indeterminate sentence in that hospital, and heavy medication that will not resemble happy pills.
This is why I get upset when I see people bashing the insanity defense or push for it not being allowed. An insanity plea is not some get out of jail free card like a lot of people picture it, it is a 'get out of being seen as human' card. No one who has actually had a loved one involuntarily committed would be so flippant with it.



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Re: ernie-wayne: ter Telgte

#127

Post by arayder » Thu Jun 07, 2018 12:04 pm

Not that Ernie would follow my advice one bit, but what he needs to do is become a lower grade contrarian. You know the kind that has a driver's license, tags, insurance, fishing/hunting license and concealed carry permit (Ernie may be ineligible for a CCP now), but gives the Mayor, town council and the school board fits on a regular basis. God help the school principal who try tell this guy's grandson that he can't take his toy gun to school.

But that's not going to happen.

Have any of you noticed how so many of Ernie's interactions aren't conversational? I know he's filmed spouting off on Youtube, or in court so the give and take of a conversation shouldn't be expected. But even in his old training films and his more recent conversations with Elias he seems to just go off on one long tangent. If you can follow him you can see massive faults of logic and frequent legal and historical misinformation. But often one's eyes just glaze over after a few minutes of Ernie talk. That works for Ernie since there's no question asked.

But when he gets going he sounds weird to me. It's like he's got some sort of autism think going. And he's got the shelves of binders he made and drags into court. It just seems weird to me.

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Re: ernie-wayne: ter Telgte

#128

Post by DejaMoo » Thu Jun 07, 2018 12:55 pm

Fortinbras wrote:
Thu Jun 07, 2018 9:41 am
Insanity pleas very seldom succeed.


Most of the time the defendant doesn't meet the legal definition of insane. You more or less have to have been in a full-blown psychotic state at the time of the crime. We casually refer to these kooks as being crazy, nuts, psycho, but we're using those terms in the popular sense. Probably most of them have personality disorders, and a good number probably are mentally ill, but very few would meet the legal definition of insane.

There's an ingrained tendency in most people to attribute cruelty, violence, and antisocial behavior to mental illness. Those are personality traits much more than they are symptoms of a health problem of any sort. Good people can have bad days, especially when they're struggling with a health condition, but it's really rare to have a health condition turn a good person into a bad one.
These folks are assholes because that's their personality. Whether or not they have a mental health condition on top of that is another issue.
But, the worst part, even when they succeed, the defendant might avoid regular prison BUT instead get sent to psychiatric prison - a psych hospital with bars and locks and such. Even if he gets sent to a regular psych hospital he ends up with fewer civil rights than if he were an ordinary inmate in an ordinary prison and frequently with an indeterminate sentence in that hospital, and heavy medication that will not resemble happy pills.
Is that still the reality in most of the US? It seems to me that our mental health care crisis means one is far more likely to receive little treatment and, if admitted whether voluntarily or otherwise, be discharged too soon, because there simply aren't enough facilities to meet the demand. And at least in my state, that includes the security hospitals, which is where the criminally-convicted and the most dangerous involuntarily-committed mentally ill are sent.



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Re: ernie-wayne: ter Telgte

#129

Post by Fortinbras » Thu Jun 07, 2018 8:08 pm

It is extremely improbable that Ernie can persuade a judge or jury (or a shrink) that he has reached a point where he cannot tell the difference between right and wrong (or, being able to tell the difference, cannot control his actions); so no insanity defense for him.

There is, sorry to say for Ernie, no Stupidity Defense. If there were, it could have been used by at least half the people who have been in prison in the last half-century. A shocking proportion of prison inmates are simply too mentally impaired to do simple arithmetic, read simple instructions, or plan simple heists. They get themselves into trouble, usually make it worse before the end of their trial, and end up in prison -- where, frankly, they are comparatively safe, at least from starvation and inclement weather. Reality is seldom like those old prison movies in which the inmates seemed so nice and clean-cut and spoke like college-grads while the officers acted like thugs, grunted like animals, and generally seemed to belong on the other side of the bars.

I'd be appreciative if someone can get a progress report of what happened and is happening in Ernie's case.



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Re: ernie-wayne: ter Telgte

#130

Post by scirreeve » Thu Jun 07, 2018 8:24 pm

Elias says Ernie is going to change his ways. Elias posted a video of We Doubt news interviewing Ernie. I won't bother posting that but in the comments Elias says this.
ernie is also agreeable to accepting my offer to apprentice in jewelry work. He is going to get his driver's license, pay his fines, get tags put on his work van, and begin to learn how to cast silver at my jewelry design studio. He is ready to put his life back together, and I'm happy to offer him gainful employment as he learns a valuable trade, that being jewelry work. He has a strong work ethic, is very good with his hands, is honest and has over the years earned my trust as a friend and good neighbor. He is ready to put his recent five year crusade to rest and reclaim his life upon the land.



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Re: ernie-wayne: ter Telgte

#131

Post by scirreeve » Thu Jun 07, 2018 8:28 pm

Fortinbras wrote:
Thu Jun 07, 2018 8:08 pm
I'd be appreciative if someone can get a progress report of what happened and is happening in Ernie's case.
He had an omnibus hearing Monday but I don't know how it went or the upcoming schedule. I asked Elias and he responded by saying he would post an update sometime this week but he hasn't yet.



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Re: ernie-wayne: ter Telgte

#132

Post by HogGravyandChitlins » Thu Jun 07, 2018 9:08 pm

scirreeve wrote:
Thu Jun 07, 2018 8:24 pm
Elias says Ernie is going to change his ways. Elias posted a video of We Doubt news interviewing Ernie. I won't bother posting that but in the comments Elias says this.
ernie is also agreeable to accepting my offer to apprentice in jewelry work. He is going to get his driver's license, pay his fines, get tags put on his work van, and begin to learn how to cast silver at my jewelry design studio. He is ready to put his life back together, and I'm happy to offer him gainful employment as he learns a valuable trade, that being jewelry work. He has a strong work ethic, is very good with his hands, is honest and has over the years earned my trust as a friend and good neighbor. He is ready to put his recent five year crusade to rest and reclaim his life upon the land.
Is it possible Ernie could actually muster up that much common sense?


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Re: ernie-wayne: ter Telgte

#133

Post by Suranis » Thu Jun 07, 2018 10:43 pm

HogGravyandChitlins wrote:
Thu Jun 07, 2018 9:08 pm
Is it possible Ernie could actually muster up that much common sense?
Why would he right now? He is known world wide because he is stupid. He's famous!


Irony can be pretty ironic sometimes.

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Re: ernie-wayne: ter Telgte

#134

Post by ArthurWankspittle » Fri Jun 08, 2018 5:28 am

scirreeve wrote:
Thu Jun 07, 2018 8:24 pm
Elias says Ernie is going to change his ways. Elias posted a video of We Doubt news interviewing Ernie. I won't bother posting that but in the comments Elias says this.
ernie is also agreeable to accepting my offer to apprentice in jewelry work. He is going to get his driver's license, pay his fines, get tags put on his work van, and begin to learn how to cast silver at my jewelry design studio. He is ready to put his life back together, and I'm happy to offer him gainful employment as he learns a valuable trade, that being jewelry work. He has a strong work ethic, is very good with his hands, is honest and has over the years earned my trust as a friend and good neighbor. He is ready to put his recent five year crusade to rest and reclaim his life upon the land.
The cynic in me says that's a preamble to Can Ernie have probation please?
PS don't take my Alford Insanity Plea too seriously guys, it is the ultimate Catch 22 as someone pointed out.


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Re: ernie-wayne: ter Telgte

#135

Post by JohnPCapitalist » Fri Jun 08, 2018 7:59 am

scirreeve wrote:
Thu Jun 07, 2018 8:24 pm
Elias says Ernie is going to change his ways. Elias posted a video of We Doubt news interviewing Ernie. I won't bother posting that but in the comments Elias says this.
ernie is also agreeable to accepting my offer to apprentice in jewelry work. He is going to get his driver's license, pay his fines, get tags put on his work van, and begin to learn how to cast silver at my jewelry design studio. He is ready to put his life back together, and I'm happy to offer him gainful employment as he learns a valuable trade, that being jewelry work. He has a strong work ethic, is very good with his hands, is honest and has over the years earned my trust as a friend and good neighbor. He is ready to put his recent five year crusade to rest and reclaim his life upon the land.
I somehow can't see Ernie giving up the outdoor woodsman image (even if it is completely bogus; he lives in a nice house with running water) to make jewelry. Instead of swinging a mighty axe and wielding a chainsaw to do manly things in a forest, he'll be using tiny, delicate tools to make tiny, delicate things. That's the sort of job that you have to be a city slicker to do. Too, also, it actually takes talent to make money as a jewelry designer.

Wonder if Ernie just said "sure, sounds interesting, I'll be in touch" to Elias. Perhaps Ernie is discovering that when you're cashing in on an act where you pretend to be a nutter, your fans actually are nutters and can be a little disturbing, so you have to sound encouraging without actually encouraging them.



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Re: ernie-wayne: ter Telgte

#136

Post by TheNewSaint » Fri Jun 08, 2018 10:35 am

JohnPCapitalist wrote:
Fri Jun 08, 2018 7:59 am
Perhaps Ernie is discovering that when you're cashing in on an act where you pretend to be a nutter, your fans actually are nutters and can be a little disturbing, so you have to sound encouraging without actually encouraging them.
HOMER: This fish makes me a champion and a hero.

MARGE: To who?

HOMER: To those weirdos in the worm store!

In all seriousness, let's not overstate the cash value of Ernie's sovcit status. I doubt he's getting many donations, and people calling in threats on his behalf is just making his trial situation worse. If what Elias says is true:
He is ready to put his recent five year crusade to rest and reclaim his life upon the land.
Then things might have gotten too real for ol' Ernie.



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Re: ernie-wayne: ter Telgte

#137

Post by arayder » Fri Jun 08, 2018 11:20 am

JohnPCapitalist wrote:
Fri Jun 08, 2018 7:59 am
scirreeve wrote:
Thu Jun 07, 2018 8:24 pm
Elias says Ernie is going to change his ways. Elias posted a video of We Doubt news interviewing Ernie. I won't bother posting that but in the comments Elias says this.
ernie is also agreeable to accepting my offer to apprentice in jewelry work. He is going to get his driver's license, pay his fines, get tags put on his work van, and begin to learn how to cast silver at my jewelry design studio. He is ready to put his life back together, and I'm happy to offer him gainful employment as he learns a valuable trade, that being jewelry work. He has a strong work ethic, is very good with his hands, is honest and has over the years earned my trust as a friend and good neighbor. He is ready to put his recent five year crusade to rest and reclaim his life upon the land.
I somehow can't see Ernie giving up the outdoor woodsman image (even if it is completely bogus; he lives in a nice house with running water) to make jewelry. Instead of swinging a mighty axe and wielding a chainsaw to do manly things in a forest, he'll be using tiny, delicate tools to make tiny, delicate things. That's the sort of job that you have to be a city slicker to do. Too, also, it actually takes talent to make money as a jewelry designer.

Wonder if Ernie just said "sure, sounds interesting, I'll be in touch" to Elias. Perhaps Ernie is discovering that when you're cashing in on an act where you pretend to be a nutter, your fans actually are nutters and can be a little disturbing, so you have to sound encouraging without actually encouraging them.
I think Ernie helped out Elias by teaching him wood cutting skills. Admirably, Elias wants to return the favor.

I too can't see Ernie giving up his guru status. If any readers watched the Viceland "Hate Thy Neighbor" show on Ernie you'll recall that Ernie's home was full of like minded sovs who saw him as a hero. It seems Ernie would not only have to: 1. swallow his pride and get a license and 2. quit making legal binders and start making jewelry, but also would have to deal with his peer's disappointment.

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Re: ernie-wayne: ter Telgte

#138

Post by Dolly » Fri Jun 08, 2018 11:38 am

scirreeve posted a video of Ernie at the court house before his appearance and included quotes from Elias Alias.
ernie's ominous omnibus June 04 2018
http://www.thefogbow.com/forum/viewtopi ... 87#p995887

Comments at Youtube:

Bearcat Fierce
2 days ago
any word how the hearing went?

Elias Alias
1 day ago (edited)
Bearcat Fierce, it was only an omnibus hearing. It went smoothly. Judge Cuffe did not require ernie to cross the bar.
I am not sure when the pre-trial hearing will happen.
ernie is hoping that the court may become willing to just drop the whole mess. If the court moves forward, there will be a jury trial in September.
ernie is trying to complete an arduous course to establish a "Correction of Status". That will take quite some time, so at the upcoming pre-trial hearing ernie will ask for a continuance until he completes his petition for correction of status.
ernie is ready to be done with the head-to-head confrontations with courts and cops. He and I both feel that he has made his point, and more of the same is no longer needed. He has a new plan and simply wants to get through this current charge of "assaulting a police officer", after which he will elevate his TAOR up several levels and move into more effective operations, which includes writing his book and becoming a jeweler's apprentice. I am the jeweler who will train him so he can earn a living once again. I am an old retired jeweler who has gone broke trying to write for the liberty movement. I am returning to jewelry work myself, and have offered ernie a position in my shop as "apprentice".
Salute!
Elias
___________________________________________________--

oscargt23
3 days ago
In regards to birth certificates, is there a connection between the word semen(sea men) as a way for them to try to justify maritime law? Would Ernie agree?
____________________________________________________________

lobetrotter
1 day ago
So, how did it go? How badly did the international copyright argument fail? I would bet Ernie didn't wait his turn and had to be restrained.
BTW Ernie should know that "Equity Court" (I think he means jurisdiction) has nothing to do with a Criminal case.


Elias Alias
1 day ago
Hi lobetrotter;
It was only an omnibus hearing. No stance was proffered by either side. Went smoothly and quickly.
The copyright on his name is just one of many steps toward "correction of status" which will take some time, possibly some months, to complete. The judge was quite fair and did not force ernie to cross the bar.
Salute!
Elias
_______________________________________________________

NoFaith
23 hours ago
And once "complete", it will fail just as all of the other wacky and stupid ideas that Ernie has latched onto have failed. You should be ashamed for encouraging him.


Dwig Buoy
5 hours ago (edited)
wrong. he did not ENCOURAGE him. i believe it sounded much like he was discouraging ernie in a previous video.. but he finished by saying that in whatever route Ernie decides to proceed, Good Elias will be by his side, documenting and supporting a good and loyal friend in whatever way he can.
And i thank-you Ernie, for being so consistently honorable in your life and greatly thank-you for posting and sharing the events and progression of the procedures.
I'm finding this extremely interesting ... i've been watching a lot of these various people in north america attempting to get back to common law and out of the maritime jurisdiction and the sneaky ways they are induced or tricked into contracting unknowingly with the state and/or standing under the authority of these agents of tyranny.

have you listened to much of Karl Lentz? The state took his offspring years ago and ever since he's been assisting people to take their problems to common law and demand return of their 'property' .. in many cases it was their son or daughter. One must refer to one's offspring as property to achieve success... often court clerks try to change the word property to child on the 'claim' (not complaint.. claim.. common law claim of injury) so they can use legalese to dismiss the attempt. one MUST refer to the child as PROPERTY not as a 'child' and demand restoration of property.
often his case is so small it's ten words or less.
"You took my property. give it back."
attachments might be a photo of the kidnapped 'property' and little else.
It can even be a spouse.
he refers to his spouse as his property and she calls him her property.
Each is 'proper' to the other by consent of both.
Hence agents of the state kidnap one, and the other can claim injury and demand return of property.
Much of what he does can by my judgement, could likely be used in a lot of other situations..
when a man acting as an agent of the corporation does wrong, by initiating violence, restraining or damaging property or man, that man (acting as an agent) can be sued under common law and restitution or reparation demanded and ordered by COMMON LAW.

If i'm right about it, one could possibly get an overenthusiastic security guard's house for stepping out beyond his jurisdiction and assaulting or kidnapping a man who has committed only a violation of acts and statutes to which he has not contracted to be under but no actual CRIME.
Murder is a crime. Theft is a crime. crossing a double yellow line is just a violation of a rule issued by a corporation to which one must contract. Usually that consent to be under contract is tacitly given without knowledge or explanation to the poor stooge who signs a drivers licence or an income tax form or birth certificate or citizenship.

anyone able to follow all that?
it's about what i've come to comprehend from a lotta hours of reading and listening.

beware... the state doesn't let it go easily, they are tricky tricky tricky, mean and nasty and double crossers.
and especially wordsmiths and equivocators.
they don't want to give up a speck of power and control
__________________________________________________
Edit: 6/9/2018 to add highlights


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Re: ernie-wayne: ter Telgte

#139

Post by pipistrelle » Fri Jun 08, 2018 12:05 pm

Ernie has a point?



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Re: ernie-wayne: ter Telgte

#140

Post by ArthurWankspittle » Fri Jun 08, 2018 12:23 pm

OMG
have you listened to much of Karl Lentz? The state took his offspring years ago and ever since he's been assisting people to take their problems to common law and demand return of their 'property'
Is that the Karl Lentz who had his child removed because he and his wife were too busy fighting to look after the child? The Karl Lentz who AFAIK has never won a case or helped anyone win a case? Next up - Controlling Inflation by Robert Mugabe.


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Re: ernie-wayne: ter Telgte

#141

Post by arayder » Fri Jun 08, 2018 1:15 pm

So Ernie wants extra time to complete his "correction of status" paperwork. The long and the short of it that he's working on another binder to add to his pile of binders. I didn't see where Elias reported whether or not the court gave Ernie extra time to get his homework done. It seems to me that the courts bend over backwards to allow defendants to prepare defenses. But, this may be one of the exceptions.

It's worth noting that nobody in the movement has jumped at the chance to help Ernie get his homework ready. I think that's because, despite the fact that Ernie's arguments are just old tired conspiracy theories, nobody can understand what the blazes he is talking about because he skips from one theory to another in an incomprehensible manner.

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Re: ernie-wayne: ter Telgte

#142

Post by JohnPCapitalist » Fri Jun 08, 2018 3:21 pm

arayder wrote:
Fri Jun 08, 2018 1:15 pm
It's worth noting that nobody in the movement has jumped at the chance to help Ernie get his homework ready. I think that's because, despite the fact that Ernie's arguments are just old tired conspiracy theories, nobody can understand what the blazes he is talking about because he skips from one theory to another in an incomprehensible manner.
Given that the poots are basically emotionally stunted, I think that what's happening here is what child development psychologists call "parallel play." It happens in kids typically 1-3 years old. They play in the same space and have some interest in what each other is doing but don't really interact much because they don't actually know how. I suspect the poots are like that. They don't help each other because they're so engrossed in building their own sandcastles of delusion that they really don't have much awareness of what other people are doing. Ernie's basically on his own.

Oh, and if he accepted help, his followers are going to wonder about whether he should be the top dog of his little group.



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Re: ernie-wayne: ter Telgte

#143

Post by arayder » Fri Jun 08, 2018 5:10 pm

JohnPCapitalist wrote:
Fri Jun 08, 2018 3:21 pm
arayder wrote:
Fri Jun 08, 2018 1:15 pm
It's worth noting that nobody in the movement has jumped at the chance to help Ernie get his homework ready. I think that's because, despite the fact that Ernie's arguments are just old tired conspiracy theories, nobody can understand what the blazes he is talking about because he skips from one theory to another in an incomprehensible manner.
Given that the poots are basically emotionally stunted, I think that what's happening here is what child development psychologists call "parallel play." It happens in kids typically 1-3 years old. They play in the same space and have some interest in what each other is doing but don't really interact much because they don't actually know how. I suspect the poots are like that. They don't help each other because they're so engrossed in building their own sandcastles of delusion that they really don't have much awareness of what other people are doing. Ernie's basically on his own.

Oh, and if he accepted help, his followers are going to wonder about whether he should be the top dog of his little group.
The subculture has, for years, been trying to challenge the jurisdiction of the courts with ever increasingly arcane theories. Ernie is basically just lumping a bunch of old theories together. You are right, JohnPCapitalist. If the poots formed a study group they'd end up having a competition to see who could come up with the craziest theory.

As it is Ernie and his supporters won't mention that their theories didn't work. The spin will be to cry how evil and corrupt the subculture thinks courts are.

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Re: ernie-wayne: ter Telgte

#144

Post by Blackbeard » Fri Jun 08, 2018 7:37 pm

pipistrelle wrote:
Fri Jun 08, 2018 12:05 pm
Ernie has a point?

Three of them. On his hat.



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Re: ernie-wayne: ter Telgte

#145

Post by Azastan » Fri Jun 08, 2018 7:55 pm

...reclaim his life upon the land
This quote alone should have given us notice that Ernie has no intention of giving up his poot ways.



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Re: ernie-wayne: ter Telgte

#146

Post by Dolly » Fri Jun 08, 2018 9:00 pm

ernie is trying to complete an arduous course to establish a "Correction of Status".
That smells like Judge Anna baloney to me.


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Re: ernie-wayne: ter Telgte

#147

Post by Notorial Dissent » Fri Jun 08, 2018 9:13 pm

Ernie hasn't changed, or learned, he s now going for the very old and tired change of status nonsense that will work every bit as poorly as everything else he's tried.

Ernie is a dilettante, and not even a good one at that, that ad I suspect he doesn't want to share the limelight, which usually doesn't go over well with the guru types.


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Re: ernie-wayne: ter Telgte

#148

Post by Siegfried Shrink » Sat Jun 09, 2018 6:31 am

He lost most of his magic with the tricorn hat. Without the crown he has no majesty; to reclaim the Iron Throne of Turtlegate he must first go on a quest to find the Hat.



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Re: ernie-wayne: ter Telgte

#149

Post by Whip » Sat Jun 09, 2018 9:35 am

arayder wrote:
Fri Jun 08, 2018 1:15 pm
It's worth noting that nobody in the movement has jumped at the chance to help Ernie get his homework ready.
indeed. where's moo to help like she did patrick? or isn't the turtle sponge worthy?



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Re: ernie-wayne: ter Telgte

#150

Post by Whip » Sat Jun 09, 2018 9:37 am

Azastan wrote:
Fri Jun 08, 2018 7:55 pm
...reclaim his life upon the land
This quote alone should have given us notice that Ernie has no intention of giving up his poot ways.
yeah. that sticks out like a sore thumb



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