Gavin Seim

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jadedmonk
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Re: Gavin Seim

#10451

Post by jadedmonk »

So let me get this right.

According to this new information Gavin is a regular church goer who, rather than lambasting others as phony Christians, is tolerant of their beliefs. He regularly challenges the views of his father and is the only one in the family who "gets away with" it. Rather than sexually objectify his wife, he empowers her, such that she has more influence in the family and community than he.

But the real message is that Gavin's not the member of the family people should fear. The fearful ones, who fell far from the tree, are some yet un-named individuals who do things like slander refuge/expats to their families back home.

What a story this is!
Regarding "...Rather than sexually objectify his wife, he empowers her, such that she has more influence in the family and community than he..." I don't know anything about that. Unless you're talking about Grant and his Wife, in which the case would be "yes" in the most affirmative!

The one who seemed to be the most insidious to us is Nathan.
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arayder
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Re: Gavin Seim

#10452

Post by arayder »

jadedmonk wrote: Mon Sep 21, 2020 11:56 am
Church services? When are the Seims attending church? Where?
They hold them at their homes, and regularly rotate the services between them.
Who is leading the services?
"Officially"? No one. In reality? Gavin & Grant.
It has been apparent that Nathan Seim has more of a stake in Mexico than Gavin, since Nathan apparently has purchased a farm and has learned Spanish. Let's hear more about that aspect. Is the farm being supplied with labour from your 'refugees'?
Originally, yes I'd say Nathan had much more of a stake in Mexico than Gavin. Oh, and by the way he's rented the land in Hidalgo, he didn't purchase it. The only "refugee labour" on the farm I'm aware of are 2 teens who were looking for work around town and they offered them more than a day's wages to help out one day with apparently some rabbits that Nathan was raising.
Exactly how many Seims are living in Mexico?
8 in Nathan's house; 7 in Gavin's house; Gavin's parents (2), who frequently have family from the States with them.
Good Info, jadedmonk. Thanks.
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Re: Gavin Seim

#10453

Post by arayder »

jadedmonk wrote: Mon Sep 21, 2020 12:06 pm
So let me get this right.

According to this new information Gavin is a regular church goer who, rather than lambasting others as phony Christians, is tolerant of their beliefs. He regularly challenges the views of his father and is the only one in the family who "gets away with" it. Rather than sexually objectify his wife, he empowers her, such that she has more influence in the family and community than he.

But the real message is that Gavin's not the member of the family people should fear. The fearful ones, who fell far from the tree, are some yet un-named individuals who do things like slander refuge/expats to their families back home.

What a story this is!
Regarding "...Rather than sexually objectify his wife, he empowers her, such that she has more influence in the family and community than he..." I don't know anything about that. Unless you're talking about Grant and his Wife, in which the case would be "yes" in the most affirmative!

The one who seemed to be the most insidious to us is Nathan.
Since you are not on Facebook you don't see how Gavin parades Sondra around like she is a street walker.
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Re: Gavin Seim

#10454

Post by DejaMoo »

Dave at Sea wrote: Mon Sep 21, 2020 1:44 am I must admit I have speculated that the content of his seized phone may contain images that he wouldn’t want LEO to see, and that may put his children at risk.
Consensus is that Gavin's a narcissist. Which suggests there could be a simpler explanation. Narcissists think they're big deals, and so anything that makes them look lesser in the eyes of others is something to be avoided at all costs. Worst of all for narcissistic men, and fundie/chauvinist men in particular, would be anything that might make them look less manly.

So - Gav's phone might not show evidence of anything illegal, but might have photos showing Gavin in a very embarrassing light. Such as Gavin wearing his wife's lingerie. Perfectly harmless and perfectly legal, but Gavin would die a thousand deaths if the cops saw him like that. He'd know, we'd know, everyone knows that if such photos existed and his phone got unlocked, all the cops for miles around would hear about them. And every time they saw Gavin thereafter, they'd smirk.

I could see him leaving the country rather than risk that type of blow to his ego. Especially if were done by the group of men he's made a point of playing dominance games with through his endless harassment of them. It would be the ultimate humiliation and he'd never get over it.
It is hard to believe that he sees his children as other than props and property.
This is exactly what narcissists do. Plus fundies, who patriarchal religions do indeed view women and children as property of their fathers and/or husbands.
I've heard this bull before.
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Re: Gavin Seim

#10455

Post by Uninformed »

Resume18 wrote: Mon Sep 21, 2020 11:36 am Gavin as PR coordinator seems a piss-poor choice. Actually, him coordinating anything seems unlikely, though PR especially.
I agree, but Gavin went to be a reporter/observer at Bunkerville, was “media coordinator” for COWS, and did much the same regarding MNWR. I’m sure he believes he is a wonderful communicator.
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Re: Gavin Seim

#10456

Post by jadedmonk »

I have to remind people (again) that what we see from Gavin is what he wants us to see. Its edited (sloppily but it is edited) and distorted. You can speculate around it, but all we have is speculation, and his videos do not, NOT present the whole picture...
Excellent point, and I wholeheartedly agree.
I don't see anything wrong with saying that you had no idea that Gav was into underage sex even if you know Gavin. Its very possible to not know everything about a guy. An remember we saw that because Gav wanted us to see that, because he wanted some short term publicity and notoriety at that time. I doubt that Gav would be broadcasting that side of himself around town in Mexico, because he would show people there what he wants the to see too.
Well said, and thank you. Also, when you understand the refugee mindset, you will understand that these people are most often desperate and don't have the time to spend qualifying a person.
Gavin is a narcissist.
I agree.
...Because of that, yes he probably IS arguing with members of his family as he is too arrogant...
Most certainly. Some of us were made aware of that fact by members of the family when he wasn't around not long after they arrived.
...As an arrogant idiot he would probably be constantly be trying to quietly yank the power away from the enter, becasue he wants to be the center of attention.
Probably right.
Yes, he is in a cult, but there are power struggles and dissension even in a cult.
That's what I'm trying to get to the bottom of - are they (it seems like they might be), and if so, how far does the damned thing go.
Plus, once again, Gavin might be making it his buisness to APPEAR to be dissenting from the rest of his family while actually toing the line in private. Because he wants to appear to be a free thinker, becasue he is a Narcissist. Narcissists suck up and punch down.
Absolutely a possibility as well, which might be why there's so much contradiction with these people, making it hard to discern what's really going on.
There is too little information to go on in one way or the other. Regardless, both scenarios could have Gavin appearing to be the awkward squad.
You're probably right again. And yes to the 2nd sentence.
...So ya contradictions between what gav wanted to show us and what he wanted to show our new member are inevitable, because they are both lies to different audiences for different reasons.
Another excellent point, and one that I hadn't thought about too much.
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Re: Gavin Seim

#10457

Post by Uninformed »

DejaMoo wrote: Mon Sep 21, 2020 12:11 pm
So - Gav's phone might not show evidence of anything illegal, but might have photos showing Gavin in a very embarrassing light.
I’ve always enjoyed the idea that the phone showed Gavin was an FBI confidential informant. :-D
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Re: Gavin Seim

#10458

Post by jadedmonk »

IOW It appears that Grant may have had the reigns for awhile, typical in a traditional family, and perhaps more and more have been given to Gavin over time and Gavin appears to be giving most of that "power" to Nathan, while Gavin now more or less acts as a spokesperson, "public relations", if you will.
Gavin as PR coordinator seems a piss-poor choice. Actually, him coordinating anything seems unlikely, though PR especially.
You overestimate most people's powers of observation. Most people see what they want to see. In the land of the blind, the one-eyed man is king.
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Re: Gavin Seim

#10459

Post by neonzx »

DejaMoo wrote: Mon Sep 21, 2020 12:11 pm
Dave at Sea wrote: Mon Sep 21, 2020 1:44 am I must admit I have speculated that the content of his seized phone may contain images that he wouldn’t want LEO to see, and that may put his children at risk.
Consensus is that Gavin's a narcissist. Which suggests there could be a simpler explanation. Narcissists think they're big deals, and so anything that makes them look lesser in the eyes of others is something to be avoided at all costs. Worst of all for narcissistic men, and fundie/chauvinist men in particular, would be anything that might make them look less manly.

So - Gav's phone might not show evidence of anything illegal, but might have photos showing Gavin in a very embarrassing light. Such as Gavin wearing his wife's lingerie. Perfectly harmless and perfectly legal, but Gavin would die a thousand deaths if the cops saw him like that. He'd know, we'd know, everyone knows that if such photos existed and his phone got unlocked, all the cops for miles around would hear about them. And every time they saw Gavin thereafter, they'd smirk.

I could see him leaving the country rather than risk that type of blow to his ego. Especially if were done by the group of men he's made a point of playing dominance games with through his endless harassment of them. It would be the ultimate humiliation and he'd never get over it.
It's an interesting take, but I'm not seeing this with Gavin. Being worried of photos showing him playing dress-up would make him leave the country?

Everything we see directly from Gavin screams stranger-danger. (who tags their photos of teen girls with #sexy? )
I think his claiming to be a professional photographer is just a way to access underage youth.

I'm staying with-->There is stuff on that phone which would put him away for life.
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Re: Gavin Seim

#10460

Post by scirreeve »

jadedmonk wrote: Mon Sep 21, 2020 11:30 am
I got my answer. You could have said Q was a big pile of nonsense. You didn't. I saw the clues in your posts.
I would if that were all. But, as I said in my last post, "Q" is more than that. It's IMO another attempt to Foment Civil War. That's a lot more than just a pile of nonsense. If I'm correct, it's treason.
I apologize jaded - I misunderstood your response.
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Re: Gavin Seim

#10461

Post by jadedmonk »

Since you are not on Facebook you don't see how Gavin parades Sondra around like she is a street walker.
Unfortunately, you don't have to be on Facebook to see that. And we wish it were just Gavin with Sondra. It's disgusting, and on YouTube many Christians have challenged Gavin for doing just that. But then in characteristic Gavin fashion he places the blame on them saying that their lusting. Gavin completely ignores the Scriptures for which he claims to support, something we saw a lot of from every family member there. There are ample Scriptures that explicitly direct people not to behave in such a fashion, but unless you specifically ask I will not provide them for you here.

Point being, this is just another classic example of how Gavin's actions (and in this case the entire Family we observed, save the new Mexican in-law) showing them to be contrary to what they claim.

THANK YOU FOR BRINGING THIS UP! This was one of the women's and the young men's most frequent complaints to me about the Family, and I neglected to mention it earlier.
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Re: Gavin Seim

#10462

Post by arayder »

jadedmonk wrote: Mon Sep 21, 2020 12:35 pm
IOW It appears that Grant may have had the reigns for awhile, typical in a traditional family, and perhaps more and more have been given to Gavin over time and Gavin appears to be giving most of that "power" to Nathan, while Gavin now more or less acts as a spokesperson, "public relations", if you will.
Gavin as PR coordinator seems a piss-poor choice. Actually, him coordinating anything seems unlikely, though PR especially.
You overestimate most people's powers of observation. Most people see what they want to see. In the land of the blind, the one-eyed man is king.
This is interesting. During youtubes of the 2015 gun rights rallies in Washington state it looks to me as though Nathan completely deferred to Gavin. But that may have been a public speaking thing. Gavin was eating up the scene with a spoon, while Nathan appeared to have a normal fear of public speaking.

In the business arena it may be the other way around.
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Re: Gavin Seim

#10463

Post by jadedmonk »

I apologize jaded - I misunderstood your response.
No worries, Mate. If I and people like me can be misled the way we were, I certainly can't judge you for not reading one of my posts. :like:
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arayder
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Re: Gavin Seim

#10464

Post by arayder »

jadedmonk wrote: Mon Sep 21, 2020 12:50 pm
Since you are not on Facebook you don't see how Gavin parades Sondra around like she is a street walker.
Unfortunately, you don't have to be on Facebook to see that. And we wish it were just Gavin with Sondra. It's disgusting, and on YouTube many Christians have challenged Gavin for doing just that. But then in characteristic Gavin fashion he places the blame on them saying that their lusting. Gavin completely ignores the Scriptures for which he claims to support, something we saw a lot of from every family member there. There are ample Scriptures that explicitly direct people not to behave in such a fashion, but unless you specifically ask I will not provide them for you here.

Point being, this is just another classic example of how Gavin's actions (and in this case the entire Family we observed, save the new Mexican in-law) showing them to be contrary to what they claim.

THANK YOU FOR BRINGING THIS UP! This was one of the women's and the young men's most frequent complaints to me about the Family, and I neglected to mention it earlier.
Gavin also put up a youtube in which he took the wife and kids to a sex motel in Mexico. We got too much information when we got to see Gavin giving a tour of the bedroom and some of the sex equipment.

It wasn't a documentary presentation. IMHO, Gavin looked like a middle school kid who had found something naughty.
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Re: Gavin Seim

#10465

Post by jadedmonk »

This is interesting. During youtubes of the 2015 gun rights rallies in Washington state it looks to me as though Nathan completely deferred to Gavin. But that may have been a public speaking thing. Gavin was eating up the scene with a spoon, while Nathan appeared to have a normal fear of public speaking.

In the business arena it may be the other way around.
What I've discovered is that Nathan is fairly good at public speaking as well, but I think you all hit the nail on the head when you say that it's Gavin's narcissism that puts him in the position of being the mouthpiece. Apparently (and 2 members of the Seim Family confided this to 2 of us early on) he just bulldozes his way to the front.

I've struggled with narcissism in my younger days, and it takes one to know one. What do you think makes it so easy for me to be the mouthpiece for our little group on this forum? The difference is that Gavin is most likely completely oblivious to his narcissism. As long as his pride continues to block constructive criticism, short of an act of God, he will never change. Once the money fizzles out (like you all are so fond of saying), it most likely won't be long as his options will become limited.

Nathan on the other hand, his pride has blinded him into a superiority complex, in my opinion. Unlike Gavin, he's extremely tactful, which in turn perhaps explains why, like I said earlier, Gavin gives him so much of his authority.

(EDITED for grammatical errors)
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Re: Gavin Seim

#10466

Post by jmj »

jadedmonk wrote: Mon Sep 21, 2020 11:56 am
Exactly how many Seims are living in Mexico?
8 in Nathan's house; 7 in Gavin's house; Gavin's parents (2), who frequently have family from the States with them.
Are you saying that Gavin's parents have moved to Mexico? I know that they visited several times, but don't remember hearing about them moving down to Mexico (though I don't always keep up with this thread). If so, Are other family members still running the business up in Washington?
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Re: Gavin Seim

#10467

Post by jadedmonk »

Are you saying that Gavin's parents have moved to Mexico? I know that they visited several times, but don't remember hearing about them moving down to Mexico (though I don't always keep up with this thread). If so, Are other family members still running the business up in Washington?
They live in San Juan del Río, Querétaro. They have been renting a house there for some time now. Most of our little group have been there several times. Gavin showed part of the property in one of his Youtube videos.

EDIT:
(Sorry, forgot to answer the other part of your question:)
"Are other family members still running the business up in Washington?"
Apparently so, they've been wanting the entire family to move to Mexico, but some just incessantly refuse, so we assumed that yes, apparently they're running the businesses for them.
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Re: Gavin Seim

#10468

Post by DejaMoo »

neonzx wrote: Mon Sep 21, 2020 12:46 pm It's an interesting take, but I'm not seeing this with Gavin. Being worried of photos showing him playing dress-up would make him leave the country?
Under the circumstances, for a narcissist, yes. Appearance is everything.
Everything we see directly from Gavin screams stranger-danger. (who tags their photos of teen girls with #sexy? )
I think his claiming to be a professional photographer is just a way to access underage youth.

I'm staying with-->There is stuff on that phone which would put him away for life.
You may be right. It's just that accusing someone of being a pedophile has now become so weaponized, I am reluctant to make such an accusation unless there's actual evidence supporting it.

Too, also, there's a difference between being a perv and being a pedo. Sometimes the only difference may be thought vs deed, but that's a legally significant difference. Gavin's a big ole perv who not only lusts after underage girls, he considers them fair game. But as to whether he's crossed the line and actually acted on those urges, we don't know.

ETA: And Occam's Razor says the simpler explanation is usually the correct one. Simpler to believe there's something on the phone that would destroy his self-esteem (lingerie pics) or reputation (federal informer) than evidence of a felony.
I've heard this bull before.
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Re: Gavin Seim

#10469

Post by jadedmonk »

Gavin also put up a youtube in which he took the wife and kids to a sex motel in Mexico. We got too much information when we got to see Gavin giving a tour of the bedroom and some of the sex equipment.

It wasn't a documentary presentation. IMHO, Gavin looked like a middle school kid who had found something naughty.
Not that I don't believe you, but could you put up a URL to this, or describe more about what happens in the video and the date it was published? I know of someone who has kept meticulous records of Gavin's YouTube videos, so even if it's no longer on YouTube they should have it.
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Re: Gavin Seim

#10470

Post by scirreeve »

jadedmonk wrote: Mon Sep 21, 2020 1:29 pm
Gavin also put up a youtube in which he took the wife and kids to a sex motel in Mexico. We got too much information when we got to see Gavin giving a tour of the bedroom and some of the sex equipment.

It wasn't a documentary presentation. IMHO, Gavin looked like a middle school kid who had found something naughty.
Not that I don't believe you, but could you put up a URL to this, or describe more about what happens in the video and the date it was published? I know of someone who has kept meticulous records of Gavin's YouTube videos, so even if it's no longer on YouTube they should have it.
I can only find a FB link to it so you might not be able to watch it.
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Re: Gavin Seim

#10471

Post by Resume18 »

scirreeve wrote: Mon Sep 21, 2020 1:45 pm
jadedmonk wrote: Mon Sep 21, 2020 1:29 pm
Gavin also put up a youtube in which he took the wife and kids to a sex motel in Mexico. We got too much information when we got to see Gavin giving a tour of the bedroom and some of the sex equipment.

It wasn't a documentary presentation. IMHO, Gavin looked like a middle school kid who had found something naughty.
Not that I don't believe you, but could you put up a URL to this, or describe more about what happens in the video and the date it was published? I know of someone who has kept meticulous records of Gavin's YouTube videos, so even if it's no longer on YouTube they should have it.
I can only find a FB link to it so you might not be able to watch it.
Going for funny, Gav and Sondra achieved icky.
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Re: Gavin Seim

#10472

Post by arayder »

jadedmonk wrote: Mon Sep 21, 2020 1:08 pm Gavin is most likely completely oblivious to his narcissism. As long as his pride continues to block constructive criticism, short of an act of God, he will never change. Once the money fizzles out (like you all are so fond of saying), it most likely won't be long as his options will become limited.

Nathan on the other hand, his pride has blinded him into a superiority complex, in my opinion. Unlike Gavin, he's extremely tactful, which in turn perhaps explains why, like I said earlier, Gavin gives him so much of his authority.
I've recently commented on Gavin's penchant for bailing out of businesses using the excuse that he's being unfairly targeted based on his freedom loving beliefs. I suspect this is Gavin's way of avoiding the narcissistic shock of having a failed business. Back in Washington it never seem to matter to him that prospective clients for his photography business might not hire him fearing he'd miss the job because he was in court, in jail or under home arrest.

It's possible the family has caught on that when the going gets tough Nathan, rather than Gavin, is the man to count on.
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Re: Gavin Seim

#10473

Post by Baidn »

jadedmonk wrote: Mon Sep 21, 2020 11:48 am
Also I would agree with the sentiment earlier that comparing being the victim of a crime with having an unpopular political ideology, even one as out there as the Sovcits is frankly a disservice to the victims and personally revolting.
I'm don't understand what you're saying here.
To clarify: saying "tell that to the victims of traffickers" when referring to someone's statement that there are welcome places in the US for people on the political spectrum all the way from Direct Democracy advocates to Fascist is the equivalent of saying "tell that to the rape survivors" or "tell that to the family of the victims of police brutality". It's a false equivalency to connect victims of a crime with someone who doesn't like that their neighbors disagree with their politics. I am willing to extend you the courtesy of the benefit of the doubt and believe you didn't mean it that way but as someone who works with organizations that advocate for such victims I would appreciate you choosing your words more carefully and not implying that unpopular political views and actual victimization are equivalent to each other.
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Re: Gavin Seim

#10474

Post by neonzx »

DejaMoo wrote: Mon Sep 21, 2020 1:18 pm You may be right. It's just that accusing someone of being a pedophile has now become so weaponized, I am reluctant to make such an accusation unless there's actual evidence supporting it.

Too, also, there's a difference between being a perv and being a pedo. Sometimes the only difference may be thought vs deed, but that's a legally significant difference. Gavin's a big ole perv who not only lusts after underage girls, he considers them fair game. But as to whether he's crossed the line and actually acted on those urges, we don't know.
imho, if Gavin actively pursues young subjects under whatever pretense (fake photo shoot, job in fake coffee shop, etc) to compromise them for his pervy pleasures, it's already a crime. I don't care if he physically touches them or not. He's exploiting them.
And he's in Mexico -- he's having a feast. It only takes a little $ to ply vulnerable, economically disadvantaged people.
ETA: And Occam's Razor says the simpler explanation is usually the correct one. Simpler to believe there's something on the phone that would destroy his self-esteem (lingerie pics) or reputation (federal informer) than evidence of a felony.
I'll agree. But Occam's Razor tells me the simplest answer is he has underage photo(s) of subjects in comprising situations. Remember, we only see the photos he publicly shares (and inappropriately comments on) -- it's seems simple to assume there are photos much worse that he doesn't post.

Regardless, be it he's a perv narcissist with a fragile ego, or full-on creepy dude who is coming for our daughters, I'm hiding all the children if he's ever roaming my neighborhood. :smoking:
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Re: Gavin Seim

#10475

Post by arayder »

Resume18 wrote: Mon Sep 21, 2020 1:56 pm
scirreeve wrote: Mon Sep 21, 2020 1:45 pm
jadedmonk wrote: Mon Sep 21, 2020 1:29 pm
Not that I don't believe you, but could you put up a URL to this, or describe more about what happens in the video and the date it was published? I know of someone who has kept meticulous records of Gavin's YouTube videos, so even if it's no longer on YouTube they should have it.
I can only find a FB link to it so you might not be able to watch it.
Going for funny, Gav and Sondra achieved icky.
I like the parts were Sondra slings herself around on the sex equipment. She is clothed. . .I'll give her that.
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