Modern Day Secessionists

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Volkonski
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Modern Day Secessionists

#1

Post by Volkonski »

Pro-Trump Republican secession rhetoric in Texas and elsewhere is more than a punchline
This kind of seditious rhetoric would spell disaster for the supposedly United States of America.


https://www.nbcnews.com/think/opinion/p ... d_nn_tw_ma
For the past few months, a long-buried idea has been creeping from the fringe into mainstream Republican discourse: secession. Following President Joe Biden’s victory in November, GOP officials from Wyoming to Florida to Mississippi have floated the idea, claiming that the time for a national fracturing may be near. While there’s something of a seasonal flavor to this injection of rhetoric — Republican honchos like former Texas Gov. Rick Perry openly discussed secession following Barack Obama’s rise to the presidency, for instance — the recent rounds feel qualitatively different. As journalist and author Richard Kreitner, an expert on American secessionism, recently wrote, it’s time to “take secessionist talk seriously.”

And it’s not difficult to see why. In the wake of the failed pro-Trump insurrection in Washington, far-right American militias, buoyed by former President Donald Trump’s empty claims that the election was “stolen,” have increasingly agitated for the break-up of the U.S. As the head of one paramilitary group that has worked closely with conspiratorial Rep. Marjorie Taylor Greene, R-Ga., recently revealed, they’d “formed alliances with other far-right groups to advocate for Georgia’s secession.” One of the primary Facebook pages promoting the rally-turned-riot was also called “Red-State Secession.” Meanwhile, mainstream outlets like Fox News joke approvingly about secessionist movements in places like northern California — despite the movement’s clear comfort with political violence — while a range of employees at Glenn Beck’s outlet continue to call for the break-up of the U.S.

And it’s not just a tiny fringe that’s thinking about these concepts anymore. As the Bright Line Watch, a group of researchers from places like Dartmouth University, the University of Rochester, and University of Chicago, noted in a study released earlier in February, one-third of Republicans said they support secession. Disturbingly, half of Republicans across the former Confederacy (plus Kentucky and Oklahoma) are now willing to break off to form a newly independent country.

Perhaps not surprisingly, Texas is leading this charge. As The Daily Beast reported, a Texas state lawmaker — one who attended the Capitol rally on Jan. 6 and claimed it was “the most amazing day” — recently filed the first serious secession bill the country has seen since the Civil War. The Texas Republican Party promptly endorsed the bill, which would give Texans the right to vote in a secession referendum later this year, with Texas Gov. Greg Abbott refusing to denounce the legislation.
Time to move all US military assets north. Time to make clear that US government benefits and pensions will cease for all residents of any state that secedes. Time to let secessionists know that if they hope to trade with the US after succession that their goods and services must continue to meet US standards.
“If everyone fought for their own convictions there would be no war.” ― Leo Tolstoy, War and Peace
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Re: Modern Day Secessionists

#2

Post by AndyinPA »

I think secessionists rarely think beyond the first step.
"Choose your leaders with wisdom and forethought. To be led by a coward is to be controlled by all that the coward fears… To be led by a liar is to ask to be told lies." -Octavia E. Butler
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filly
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Re: Modern Day Secessionists

#3

Post by filly »

Geez, these morons can't even get the electrical grid to work.

Time to move?
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Re: Modern Day Secessionists

#4

Post by MN-Skeptic »

So... an American Brexit. Maybe the Texas secessionists might want to see how the United Kingdom is now faring.
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Re: Modern Day Secessionists

#5

Post by zekeb »

AndyinPA wrote: Mon Mar 01, 2021 10:33 am I think secessionists rarely think beyond the first step.
Like all revolutionists, all is fine if they get to be in charge. Few get it their way, though. Of all the revolutions in the past 100 years, how many times were the people better off after the big show?
Largo al factotum.
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Re: Modern Day Secessionists

#6

Post by Volkonski »

Idaho Lawmakers Hear Pitch to Make Idaho the Third Largest State

https://www.courthousenews.com/idaho-la ... est-state/
In a mostly maskless meeting Monday, the Idaho Legislature considered expanding its territory to absorb 22 Oregon counties under a plan proponents say is necessary because voters in Portland determine the policies that run the state.

Mike McCarter, the Oregonian behind Move Oregon’s Border and Citizens for Greater Idaho, laid out the idea at a joint meeting of Idaho’s House Environment, Energy & Technology Committee and the Senate Resources & Environment Committee. In addition to 22 of Oregon’s 36 counties, Greater Idaho would also include parts of California and Washington state. McCarter said the motivation behind the plan is freedom from rules meted out by “Willamette Valley Democrats.”

“The people want to be independent of an overreaching state government and given the opportunity to raise their families the way they want,” McCarter said. “The opportunity to provide an income off their land. To start or operate profitable businesses. Enjoy life without being lorded over.”

Frustration with environmental regulations and restrictions to stop the spread of Covid-19 were recurring themes in McCarter’s presentation.
Image

Later in the meeting when the Idahoans started asking about details the Oregonians didn't have many answers.
“If everyone fought for their own convictions there would be no war.” ― Leo Tolstoy, War and Peace
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Re: Modern Day Secessionists

#7

Post by pipistrelle »

Ah, a variant of the "State of Jefferson."
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Re: Modern Day Secessionists

#8

Post by northland10 »

A bunch of Ammon's gang probably would love this, though Ammo seems to be making enemies with Idaho as well. I suspect their Poot Pocket Protector Constitution skips over that whole Article 4 Section 3 thing.
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Re: Modern Day Secessionists

#9

Post by noblepa »

northland10 wrote: Tue Apr 13, 2021 9:01 am A bunch of Ammon's gang probably would love this, though Ammo seems to be making enemies with Idaho as well. I suspect their Poot Pocket Protector Constitution skips over that whole Article 4 Section 3 thing.
This is a little off-topic. I knew what you were saying, but I looked up Article 4, section 3 anyway. While reading it, I also saw section 4 "The United States shall guarantee to every State in this Union a Republican Form of Government . . .".

I think that some in the GOP think that means that the Constitution mandates that they be the ruling party. Certainly at the state level, with rampant and blatant gerrymandering taking place, they seem to act that way.
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Re: Modern Day Secessionists

#10

Post by raison de arizona »

These numbers are disturbing, particularly in the south.
Image
http://brightlinewatch.org/still-miles- ... residency/
Image
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Re: Modern Day Secessionists

#11

Post by Volkonski »

“If everyone fought for their own convictions there would be no war.” ― Leo Tolstoy, War and Peace
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Re: Modern Day Secessionists

#12

Post by AndyinPA »

Perhaps someone could direct them to the Brexit thread. ;)
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Re: Modern Day Secessionists

#13

Post by Fiascoist »

Nuthin' new to see here, move along, move along. I remember as a kid, under 10, so many, many years ago about petitions for southern Oregon and northern California to create the state of Jefferson. Worried me because of all the new things I would have to learn, state flag, state capital, etc. I believe these threats have been a piece of Americana since the beginning since we started with a base that lived the philosophy if you don't play the way I want, I will just take my ball and go home.
In some years hence, it will be the democrats wanting to bail.
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Re: Modern Day Secessionists

#14

Post by filly »

Active Duty Military Installations

Texas is the proud home to 15 active duty military installations with an economic impact of over $100 billion. The enduring missions, beneficial partnerships, and promising outlook validate each installation’s vital role in our nation’s defense. The TMPC continues to advocate for Texas’ military personnel and installations, while fostering positive relationships at the local, state and federal level.
https://gov.texas.gov/organization/mili ... tallations

Yes, the link is to the Office of the Governor web page.
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Re: Modern Day Secessionists

#15

Post by Volkonski »

Advocates of Texit live in a dream world.

Texas is so thoroughly integrated with the USA that any attempt to separate would create chaos greater than Brexit.

Most Texas voters would vote that down if it ever got on a ballot.
“If everyone fought for their own convictions there would be no war.” ― Leo Tolstoy, War and Peace
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Re: Modern Day Secessionists

#16

Post by Azastan »

Volkonski wrote: Mon Sep 20, 2021 12:21 pm

Most Texas voters would vote that down if it ever got on a ballot.
Ahem.

These are the same people who voted for Donald Trump.
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Re: Modern Day Secessionists

#17

Post by Volkonski »

If they want to be able to vote for Trump again Texas needs to remain a US state. ;)
“If everyone fought for their own convictions there would be no war.” ― Leo Tolstoy, War and Peace
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Re: Modern Day Secessionists

#18

Post by p0rtia »

Hey, I'm a secessionist. Atlantica. It's a thing.

How to Secede in Bigness. It's the new family after dinner discussion following holiday meals. We ponder how to split PA in half to include it in Atlantica, and what to do with Virginia and DC.

Alas I will not live long enough.

https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/the ... tep-guide/

So you want to secede from the U.S.: A four-step guide

Option 1: Ask politely = Odds of success: Zero.
Option 2: Amend the Constitution = Odds of success: Low.
Option 3: Withdraw by force = Odds of success: Basically zero.
Option 4: Await the collapse of the American experiment = Odds of success: 100 percent.
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Re: Modern Day Secessionists

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Post by northland10 »

At least Texas and Texas A&M will be able to compete for a national championship. Too bad they will lose all those sweet SEC bucks. The Southwest Conference will rise again.
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Re: Modern Day Secessionists

#20

Post by filly »

northland10 wrote: Wed Sep 22, 2021 2:20 pm At least Texas and Texas A&M will be able to compete for a national championship. Too bad they will lose all those sweet SEC bucks. The Southwest Conference will rise again.
Maybe that's a good thing. The Aggie tears cause flooding.
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Re: Modern Day Secessionists

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Post by RTH10260 »

Volkonski wrote: Wed Sep 22, 2021 1:38 pm If they want to be able to vote for Trump again Texas needs to remain a US state. ;)
But Mr T could become the next impotus for a free TX :lol:
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Re: Modern Day Secessionists

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Post by keith »

noblepa wrote: Tue Apr 13, 2021 9:28 am I think that some in the GOP think that means that the Constitution mandates that they be the ruling party. Certainly at the state level, with rampant and blatant gerrymandering taking place, they seem to act that way.
I can report as fact, from arguments presented during discussions back in the birther heyday, that this is 100% absolutely correct.
Has everybody heard about the bird?
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Re: Modern Day Secessionists

#23

Post by noblepa »

Volkonski wrote: Wed Sep 22, 2021 1:38 pm If they want to be able to vote for Trump again Texas needs to remain a US state. ;)
Not necessarily. If they were to vote to secede, I think that they might also vote to make Donald Trump their first president, or maybe King. They would probably waive any residency requirements.
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Re: Modern Day Secessionists

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Post by Azastan »

Volkonski wrote: Wed Sep 22, 2021 1:38 pm If they want to be able to vote for Trump again Texas needs to remain a US state. ;)
He could be president of Texas, though.
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Re: Modern Day Secessionists

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Post by AndyinPA »

Azastan wrote: Thu Sep 23, 2021 1:07 am
Volkonski wrote: Wed Sep 22, 2021 1:38 pm If they want to be able to vote for Trump again Texas needs to remain a US state. ;)
He could be president of Texas, though.
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